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Wags

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They all roll down the line in whatever order they are scheduled in.
correct, but I can see Ford delaying Raptors until it's over. I see management building the same truck over and over again. Raptors are different and require different parts, but who knows.
 

Ranger#5?

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As someone who’s worked at an automotive supplier, who went on strike, you don’t want that truck. The replacements do the best they can, but they’re just not trained like the regular workers. You’re talking about software developers, middle management, maybe engineers.
may be the opposite. Quality might actually be better in this case. Engineers, SW, QA/QC, Systems, DVT and others are going to pay more attention to detail IMO. I expect only people with some kind of aptitude for hands on work along with using their brains would be considered trainable for these positions- not secretaries, janitors and career middle manager types. My experience as a union worker in Aerospace showed me majority of my coworkers were promoted into their positions based on seniority- not skill or education specific to jobs they filled. Most started with menial positions like 3rd shift janitor, shipping and receiving, stockroom, etc. They had to be taught to do things by rote in very simple processes and could not think outside that box and rarely noticed anything that might be wrong outside of the limited instructions they had been given for their 1 task.
 

Ranger#5?

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correct, but I can see Ford delaying Raptors until it's over. I see management building the same truck over and over again. Raptors are different and require different parts, but who knows.
they will have to be able to build Broncos at the same time, so some flexibility will probably be required for the fill ins.
 

Wayfaring Ranger

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may be the opposite. Quality might actually be better in this case. Engineers, SW, QA/QC, Systems, DVT and others are going to pay more attention to detail IMO. I expect only people with some kind of aptitude for hands on work along with using their brains would be considered trainable for these positions- not secretaries, janitors and career middle manager types. My experience as a union worker in Aerospace showed me majority of my coworkers were promoted into their positions based on seniority- not skill or education specific to jobs they filled. Most started with menial positions like 3rd shift janitor, shipping and receiving, stockroom, etc. They had to be taught to do things by rote in very simple processes and could not think outside that box and rarely noticed anything that might be wrong outside of the limited instructions they had been given for their 1 task.
This is how i see it. QA will be more strict and they won't be furiously building hundreds of trucks per day at a rate where issues get missed. Slow and steady. I'm not concerned about it.

Modern assembly lines aren't difficult to learn and literally anyone can do them with some instruction. In the rare case you get an issue, that's why we get a warranty.
 

bking

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may be the opposite. Quality might actually be better in this case. Engineers, SW, QA/QC, Systems, DVT and others are going to pay more attention to detail IMO. I expect only people with some kind of aptitude for hands on work along with using their brains would be considered trainable for these positions- not secretaries, janitors and career middle manager types. My experience as a union worker in Aerospace showed me majority of my coworkers were promoted into their positions based on seniority- not skill or education specific to jobs they filled. Most started with menial positions like 3rd shift janitor, shipping and receiving, stockroom, etc. They had to be taught to do things by rote in very simple processes and could not think outside that box and rarely noticed anything that might be wrong outside of the limited instructions they had been given for their 1 task.
You'd think so, but the more likely scenario is that anyone who isn't mission critical at the moment will be put on a bus to MAP for quick training and start building trucks. We'll see, but I hope mine is built after a new contract is signed. Don't really want a strike truck or a contract negotiation truck.
 

Mikknj

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I don’t see management building raptors, maybe just the regular rangers and other similar vehicles but not the speciality ones
That makes no sense to me. These people are going to build the raptors and the regular rangers as well. It's not like the raptors are some special quality thing...
 

Wayfaring Ranger

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That makes no sense to me. These people are going to build the raptors and the regular rangers as well. It's not like the raptors are some special quality thing...
No kidding.

Regular Ranger Instructions: "Grab part A and insert into slot B"

Ranger Raptor Instructions: "Grab part C and insert into slot D"
 

DirtyRanger

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You'd think so, but the more likely scenario is that anyone who isn't mission critical at the moment will be put on a bus to MAP for quick training and start building trucks. We'll see, but I hope mine is built after a new contract is signed. Don't really want a strike truck or a contract negotiation truck.
They've likely already had strike training by now. When the IAM contract came up, any engineer with over a year's tenure was cycled through gap training in about a months time.

Watercooler politics aside, a strike will give opportunity for the engineers to understand the shortcomings of the processes they maintain firsthand. There's only so much you can glean from floor walks and the occasional complaint.
 

Wags

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That makes no sense to me. These people are going to build the raptors and the regular rangers as well. It's not like the raptors are some special quality thing...
I don't work in the industry, so I have no idea how it works. I just think it seems easier to train people that don't do this every day to build the same thing every day. Then the next day or week switch to a different model. But like I said, I have no idea how it works.

Let's just hope for no strike so we don't need to worry about it. If UPS can do it, then Ford can.
 

goalieThreeOne

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may be the opposite. Quality might actually be better in this case. Engineers, SW, QA/QC, Systems, DVT and others are going to pay more attention to detail IMO. I expect only people with some kind of aptitude for hands on work along with using their brains would be considered trainable for these positions- not secretaries, janitors and career middle manager types. My experience as a union worker in Aerospace showed me majority of my coworkers were promoted into their positions based on seniority- not skill or education specific to jobs they filled. Most started with menial positions like 3rd shift janitor, shipping and receiving, stockroom, etc. They had to be taught to do things by rote in very simple processes and could not think outside that box and rarely noticed anything that might be wrong outside of the limited instructions they had been given for their 1 task.
I don’t believe that. Office workers are not used to repetitive physical tasks. I’d put my money on them to check out mentally more quickly than a factory worker that’s been doing it for decades.
 

goalieThreeOne

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Don’t forget everyone, the strike isn’t company-wide. It only starts at one factory and more get added the longer it takes to get to an agreement. MAP may not even be the first to go on strike. If UAW wanted to hit them the hardest they’d start with Louisville to hit their cash cow full size truck. I suppose the extremely profitable Bronco might be a target but I’d be going after F150 or Mustang first.
 

Stretch

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I worked at Honda during my college years on the assembly line. One thing you never wanted was the cars built during holidays or hunting season or the like. Lack of experience also makes you afraid to stop the assembly line if something isn't going right. Add to that if you are getting alot of one off cars (different options/trim levels). Its muscle memory that makes it run smoothly. I can only imagine a bunch of people unexperienced trying to run the line. All those vehicles will be pushed off the line instead of driving under their own power.
 

Ranger#5?

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I don’t believe that. Office workers are not used to repetitive physical tasks. I’d put my money on them to check out mentally more quickly than a factory worker that’s been doing it for decades.
I think you're putting too much importance on the concept of "office workers" vs. "real workers" who get dirty on the line working the lines. So much is already automated by robots or specialty assisted equipment, there just isn't that much physical prowess needed directing the automated lug nut spinner into place or attaching interior parts, etc. I'm sure you've seen all the pictures and videos of factories by now like the rest of us. From my experience up and down the ladder from lowly production assembler to system test, engineering design verification, R&D test and design, QA/QC, regulatory compliance, environmental labs and more- quality trainings and ISO stuff gets hammered into you and there is a whole lot of overlap between knowing the processes that occurred before the work ends up in front of you for your part and then knowing what you are expected to deliver to the next operation after you and what they do with it. I get it if you're skeptical but cross training happens everywhere all the time these days, and aside from some growing pains with mistakes same as when a new hire is breaking in, the finished product should be pretty much indistinguishable to the end customer receiving their truck.

As always YMMV.
 

goalieThreeOne

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I think you're putting too much importance on the concept of "office workers" vs. "real workers" who get dirty on the line working the lines. So much is already automated by robots or specialty assisted equipment, there just isn't that much physical prowess needed directing the automated lug nut spinner into place or attaching interior parts, etc. I'm sure you've seen all the pictures and videos of factories by now like the rest of us. From my experience up and down the ladder from lowly production assembler to system test, engineering design verification, R&D test and design, QA/QC, regulatory compliance, environmental labs and more- quality trainings and ISO stuff gets hammered into you and there is a whole lot of overlap between knowing the processes that occurred before the work ends up in front of you for your part and then knowing what you are expected to deliver to the next operation after you and what they do with it. I get it if you're skeptical but cross training happens everywhere all the time these days, and aside from some growing pains with mistakes same as when a new hire is breaking in, the finished product should be pretty much indistinguishable to the end customer receiving their truck.

As always YMMV.
I think you misunderstod what I meant. I don't mean physical tasks as in they are physically demanding. Both office worker and productions worker perform tedious tasks all the time. For an office worker that might mean filling out spreadsheets and forms staring at a screen for eight hours a day. For a production worker, that might mean attaching the same three parts over and over again 30-100 times a day. Both can be mind numbing but there's a certain mentality that's need to accomplish these tasks both efficiently and correctly many times a day. Early in my career I was tasked as engineering support for production. The first two months of that job required me to work on the line to understand the physical items we were producing. I have literally done the exact thing that Ford is asking its office workers to do before. And I can tell you its not plug and play. Despite my two months on various stations of the line, every single worker there could absolutely school me on assembly. Their hands and coordination are just faster and more precise. They see things with their eyes that go unnoticed by other because of their experience. These are men and women who I wouldn't count on to fill out a spreadsheet that could spin wrenches like Billy the Kid. They could build harnesses and terminate conductors faster than most journeymen electricians I've worked with. It's just a different skillset. Sure, give an office worker 12 months on the line and they'll get there, but it's nothing that's going to happen right away.

The one thing I can absolutely agree with that's been mentioned in this thread, is getting some of the design staff some hands on time with assembly might make for a better process by the time all is said and done.
 

Ranger#5?

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I think you misunderstod what I meant. I don't mean physical tasks as in they are physically demanding. Both office worker and productions worker perform tedious tasks all the time. For an office worker that might mean filling out spreadsheets and forms staring at a screen for eight hours a day. For a production worker, that might mean attaching the same three parts over and over again 30-100 times a day. Both can be mind numbing but there's a certain mentality that's need to accomplish these tasks both efficiently and correctly many times a day. Early in my career I was tasked as engineering support for production. The first two months of that job required me to work on the line to understand the physical items we were producing. I have literally done the exact thing that Ford is asking its office workers to do before. And I can tell you its not plug and play. Despite my two months on various stations of the line, every single worker there could absolutely school me on assembly. Their hands and coordination are just faster and more precise. They see things with their eyes that go unnoticed by other because of their experience. These are men and women who I wouldn't count on to fill out a spreadsheet that could spin wrenches like Billy the Kid. They could build harnesses and terminate conductors faster than most journeymen electricians I've worked with. It's just a different skillset. Sure, give an office worker 12 months on the line and they'll get there, but it's nothing that's going to happen right away.

The one thing I can absolutely agree with that's been mentioned in this thread, is getting some of the design staff some hands on time with assembly might make for a better process by the time all is said and done.
I took it as you were suggesting that line workers work with their hands, while "office workers" work with their brains and white-collar skills and would not be able to fill in working with their hands efficiently. I know plenty of white collar or salaried employees who worked manual labor and/or enjoyed hobbies that ended up in salaried positions at some point, but worked with their hands most of their lives outside of their employment at any given period in the career. I am 1 of them.
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