Sound deadening the doors was totally worth the time.

[pablo94sc]

? The Siless 3 in 1 is a completely different thing than the NVX 90mil. The Siless 3 in 1 is 200mil with 3 layers including an actual sound dampening layer along with the sound deadening layer and foam layer. The foam/dampening material specifically is what I believe helped reduce the boomyness of the speakers. The NVX 90 is only the deadening layer which just reduces resonance/vibration. You can use the 3 in 1 by itself or you can use it along with a layer of NVX or whatever you prefer. It works well by itself, but like I said I did use an extra layer of deadening directly behind the speakers. A lot of people use a deadening layer and sound proofing foam onto of that. But if you were only getting 1 and wanting to save weight and not go crazy with it the 3 in 1 works very well.

The 3in1 is meant for placing on panels that will benefit from having a decoupling layer. The inner door skin doesn't have anything touching the CLD mat, so the foam is useless. In fact, almost all of the exterior (metal) panels have zero use for it. Plus, the butyl layer and constrainment layer (aluminum foil) do a worse job of actual resonance reduction compared to many others, like NVX. It's one of the better, inexpensive CLD out there in terms of performance.

You're better off with an actual insulation layer that's 1/2"-1" thick to both absorb sound (turn it into heat) and decouple trim panels from sheet metal. Anywhere you need to spot treat, you use tessa tape, some felt, scrap insulation, etc. The Siless stuff is bargain bin CLD (lower quality butyl layer) that sells because people don't understand that the foam layer is virtually useless, providing almost zero benefit.

Tl;dr if you only want one layer, get a quality butyl/foil only CLD. 3n1 is lipstick on a pig. It works, but the foam is pointless and you're getting a lower quality CLD for the same money as something like NVX.

If you don't believe me, read here:

https://resonixsoundsolutions.com/r...DdX7pXKFyN6zYuJse2uFAa79sAJ4tlB8AuqvjQaCIld-F

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[nate.co]

If you don't believe me, read here:

https://resonixsoundsolutions.com/r...DdX7pXKFyN6zYuJse2uFAa79sAJ4tlB8AuqvjQaCIld-F

Did they actually test against the Siless Hybrid 3in1? It's not listed in that comparison. They have a couple other much thinner items they tested against but I don't see that one.

All I can say is I used the 200 mil Siless Hybrid and it made a huge difference (even without replacing the speakers). No metal foil means I could easily cut it and place it in the doors without shredding my fingers or using any extra tools, just cleaning with some alcohol and pressing into place.

Add in the speaker replacements and it is a night and day difference. Doors sound like you're closing a vault now, not some rattling shed door.

 

[SubZombie]

The 3in1 is meant for placing on panels that will benefit from having a decoupling layer. The inner door skin doesn't have anything touching the CLD mat, so the foam is useless. In fact, almost all of the exterior (metal) panels have zero use for it. Plus, the butyl layer and constrainment layer (aluminum foil) do a worse job of actual resonance reduction compared to many others, like NVX. It's one of the better, inexpensive CLD out there in terms of performance.

You're better off with an actual insulation layer that's 1/2"-1" thick to both absorb sound (turn it into heat) and decouple trim panels from sheet metal. Anywhere you need to spot treat, you use tessa tape, some felt, scrap insulation, etc. The Siless stuff is bargain bin CLD (lower quality butyl layer) that sells because people don't understand that the foam layer is virtually useless, providing almost zero benefit.

Tl;dr if you only want one layer, get a quality butyl/foil only CLD. 3n1 is lipstick on a pig. It works, but the foam is pointless and you're getting a lower quality CLD for the same money as something like NVX.

If you don't believe me, read here:

https://resonixsoundsolutions.com/r...DdX7pXKFyN6zYuJse2uFAa79sAJ4tlB8AuqvjQaCIld-F

I disagree based on first hand experience and before and after results, which is something you have no experience with (clearly because numerous things you’re saying about the 3 in 1 are literally incorrect) and everything you’re saying is a theory. I get you feeling that way, but if you haven’t personally installed it and used it don’t act like you’re an expert from your internet research.

I also find it hilarious that you think self serving results from a company trying to promote their own products (which are ridiculously expensive) is going to be something anyone should take to heart. I get that the owner is a likable guy, but he can also test things in a way that best suites his product, which he very clearly does. Not to mention I don’t believe they have ever even tested the Siless hybrid.

More over, I said two things in my original post that you seem to completely disregard.

1) I did install the 3-in-1 on top of a butly layer I just only used 1 big sheet of it directly behind the speakers because that type of deadening has exponentially diminishing returns. Putting it over 1/4th or 1/3rd of the door and the whole door makes very little difference. Though the 3-in-1 does have its own butyl. In my last Tacoma I used a thick butyl layer only over the entire door outside and inside and it made the door ridiculously heavy and I was disappointed that it had almost no impact on sound quality but it did reduce vibrations.

More over, the 3 in 1 does not have aluminum foil on it at all, it is plastic, and that plastic layer is not 1 of the 3 layers, it would be 4 in 1 if they advertised it like that.

2) I didn’t install this to reduce wind/road noise at all, I was merely shocked at how much it reduced it. And the way resonix does their test, it literally only tests how much vibrations are reduced going through metal, it doesn’t measure the material’s ability to dampen out or absorb sounds bouncing around inside of the door chamber, which is why I think the multilayer material works so well.

I did the install to improve the audio quality, not to make the interior quieter. That was merely a benefit that surprised me more than I expected.

And to that point, I am very into home audio and I am very familiar with the fact that you put sound absorbing (not resonance deadening) material behind speakers, especially speakers that put out lots of bass, in order to improve clarity through reducing reflections while also improving bass response and reducing boomy bass. In addition I wanted to remove some of the harshness from the mid range which is amplified by reflections from the door panels.
That was the main point of my install, and to that point it was very successful, much more so than using just a deadening layer which would not have achieved the goal I was going for.


I am also very aware I could have used a butyl layer and a separate specific deadening foam layer on top of that. But the 3 in 1 made the install quicker and easier and accomplished the result I was after and I also believe it will be more durable in a door panel than straight foam because of the plastic layer it has over it.

Basically, you’re bringing up resonance, and reducing resonance specifically wasn’t the goal, because it’s not really a problem in the door panels to start with imo.

 

[Donnie B]

So any thumbs up on this selection?
NVX® SDBP40 90 mil Thick 36 sqft.
I must admit....I'm better at turning wrenches than researching to the ends of the earth. Thank you all for your suggestions.

 

[pablo94sc]

Did they actually test against the Siless Hybrid 3in1? It's not listed in that comparison. They have a couple other much thinner items they tested against but I don't see that one.

All I can say is I used the 200 mil Siless Hybrid and it made a huge difference (even without replacing the speakers). No metal foil means I could easily cut it and place it in the doors without shredding my fingers or using any extra tools, just cleaning with some alcohol and pressing into place.

Add in the speaker replacements and it is a night and day difference. Doors sound like you're closing a vault now, not some rattling shed door.

You can get the vault closing sound with Amazon basics CLD. Lol

I get it. You bought this stuff and now want confirmation you made the right choice. It works, enjoy it, but it's likely no better than their 80mil stuff.

 

[Donnie B]

Haven't bought a thing yet brother. Got way too many vehicles and such to play with. I see you have a Focus. Enjoy!

 

[pablo94sc]

Haven't bought a thing yet brother. Got way too many vehicles and such to play with. I see you have a Focus. Enjoy!

Me? That's one of three I have running, but it's earmarked for the kid when he turns 16. The other reply was to Nate.

 

[Donnie B]

Sweet. I have a great deal of respect for a man who cares for his family and introduces his son to the world of vehicles. I also see you are in Tennesse and hope you are not the recipient of some of the weather I see on the channel that has come your way. PM me if you like and we'll share some pics and stories. Thank you for your honest opinion and time to reply. Be well...Donnie B

 

[GLW]

Haven't bought a thing yet brother. Got way too many vehicles and such to play with. I see you have a Focus. Enjoy!

I know nothing about sound deadening but used I used one layer of Siless Max 120 mil (3mm) 30 sqft Car Sound Deadening mat and one layer of Siless Hybrid 3in1 200 mil 25 sqft Car Sound Deadening mat on every square inch I could reach in all four doors.

one box each was enough for all four doors and the rear bulkhead (don’t bother with that as it was a pain for little gain).

The result is the single best mod I’ve done to my truck thus far and I’ve done a lot.

 

[SubZombie]

You can get the vault closing sound with Amazon basics CLD. Lol

I get it. You bought this stuff and now want confirmation you made the right choice. It works, enjoy it, but it's likely no better than their 80mil stuff.

I feel like you're the one trying to get confirmation bias. This whole thread was made just because I was surprised with the results, which I have done lots of things that cost a lot more to this truck and not made posts about many of them at all.

I would also point out that NVX also sells a hybrid that has a butyl layer and a closed cell foam layer. I actually looked at it and read impressions before I went with the Siless, because the Siless was thicker with more material, a layer to ABSORB sound, AND it was a better value with that layer that the NVX doesn't have.

A butyl rubber layer alone has no ability to absorb or insulate sound. The layers exist solely to add mass to sheet metal to reduce vibrations. It is not the same as a product that does absorb and insulate sound, so I'm not sure why you're so set on claiming that it will do the same thing when even the manufacturers themselves make no such claims (because its just not true).

 

[nate.co]

You can get the vault closing sound with Amazon basics CLD. Lol

I get it. You bought this stuff and now want confirmation you made the right choice. It works, enjoy it, but it's likely no better than their 80mil stuff.

LOLOLOLOL. OK. Have a nice day.

 

[pablo94sc]

I disagree based on first hand experience and before and after results, which is something you have no experience with (clearly because numerous things you’re saying about the 3 in 1 are literally incorrect) and everything you’re saying is a theory. I get you feeling that way, but if you haven’t personally installed it and used it don’t act like you’re an expert from your internet research.

I also find it hilarious that you think self serving results from a company trying to promote their own products (which are ridiculously expensive) is going to be something anyone should take to heart. I get that the owner is a likable guy, but he can also test things in a way that best suites his product, which he very clearly does. Not to mention I don’t believe they have ever even tested the Siless hybrid.

More over, I said two things in my original post that you seem to completely disregard.

1) I did install the 3-in-1 on top of a butly layer I just only used 1 big sheet of it directly behind the speakers because that type of deadening has exponentially diminishing returns. Putting it over 1/4th or 1/3rd of the door and the whole door makes very little difference. Though the 3-in-1 does have its own butyl. In my last Tacoma I used a thick butyl layer only over the entire door outside and inside and it made the door ridiculously heavy and I was disappointed that it had almost no impact on sound quality but it did reduce vibrations.

More over, the 3 in 1 does not have aluminum foil on it at all, it is plastic, and that plastic layer is not 1 of the 3 layers, it would be 4 in 1 if they advertised it like that.

2) I didn’t install this to reduce wind/road noise at all, I was merely shocked at how much it reduced it. And the way resonix does their test, it literally only tests how much vibrations are reduced going through metal, it doesn’t measure the material’s ability to dampen out or absorb sounds bouncing around inside of the door chamber, which is why I think the multilayer material works so well.

I did the install to improve the audio quality, not to make the interior quieter. That was merely a benefit that surprised me more than I expected.

And to that point, I am very into home audio and I am very familiar with the fact that you put sound absorbing (not resonance deadening) material behind speakers, especially speakers that put out lots of bass, in order to improve clarity through reducing reflections while also improving bass response and reducing boomy bass. In addition I wanted to remove some of the harshness from the mid range which is amplified by reflections from the door panels.
That was the main point of my install, and to that point it was very successful, much more so than using just a deadening layer which would not have achieved the goal I was going for.


I am also very aware I could have used a butyl layer and a separate specific deadening foam layer on top of that. But the 3 in 1 made the install quicker and easier and accomplished the result I was after and I also believe it will be more durable in a door panel than straight foam because of the plastic layer it has over it.

Basically, you’re bringing up resonance, and reducing resonance specifically wasn’t the goal, because it’s not really a problem in the door panels to start with imo.

Yeah, actually, resonance is the issue. If it wasn't, then why did you install a CLD product instead of foam diffusers or absoption panels?

I mean look, if it works for you then great.

I feel like you're the one trying to get confirmation bias. This whole thread was made just because I was surprised with the results, which I have done lots of things that cost a lot more to this truck and not made posts about many of them at all.

I would also point out that NVX also sells a hybrid that has a butyl layer and a closed cell foam layer. I actually looked at it and read impressions before I went with the Siless, because the Siless was thicker with more material, a layer to ABSORB sound, AND it was a better value with that layer that the NVX doesn't have.

A butyl rubber layer alone has no ability to absorb or insulate sound. The layers exist solely to add mass to sheet metal to reduce vibrations. It is not the same as a product that does absorb and insulate sound, so I'm not sure why you're so set on claiming that it will do the same thing when even the manufacturers themselves make no such claims (because its just not true).

It does the same thing because the Siless is primarily a CLD tile with some foam sandwiched between an outer mass layer. The primary butyl layer against the car panel does the heavy lifting here. CCF is a poor absorption layer, and at that thickness provides neglible benefits; it is strictly a decoupler.

The outer butyl mass layer may block a tad bit of sound, but it's really not doing anything except adding weight here. Without full coverage you're going to have sound enter the cabin. That's one of many reasons why MLV has fallen out of favor as an acoustic treatment. It is simply is too hard to install properly to fully benefit from its use.

What that boils down to is the foam and outer mass layer aren't really useful here. For the money spent, you're better off buying CLD that will further reduce panel resonance. I suggest NVX because it's priced well for the reduction in resonance it provides and easy to get, not because it's the best product out there. If you were fully covering the inner door skin or a full covering of the floor and bulkheads, then maybe the Siless would be okay. But for what most people are doing at home, like the outer door skins and maybe a little extra here and there, it's just extra weight.

PS - resonance was what was coloring your music.

 

[Texas Ranger]

Ya'll got me fired up to tackle this mod now.

Before I start should I order any replacement parts that might break on me?

 

[GLW]

Ya'll got me fired up to tackle this mod now.

Before I start should I order any replacement parts that might break on me?

I didn’t break or lose anything on the truck but I really did appreciate having a pair of mechanic's gloves and a good set of the nylon pry tools. I had a cheaper set from Amazon that I broke an end off one of them doing something dumb but luckily I ordered a better 3 piece set from Crutchfield when I got my new speakers to install with the deadening.

I had never taken door panels off a vehicle before so it was a new experience for me.

Have fun, you won’t regret it.

 

[nate.co]

I didn’t break or lose anything on the truck but I really did appreciate having a pair of mechanic's gloves and a good set of the nylon pry tools. I had a cheaper set from Amazon that I broke an end off one of them doing something dumb but luckily I ordered a better 3 piece set from Crutchfield when I got my new speakers to install with the deadening.

I had never taken door panels off a vehicle before so it was a new experience for me.

Have fun, you won’t regret it.

Yup, +1 on all that -- I'd also pick up that trim clip pliers from an early post on this thread. Honestly the door panels are really easy to take off and put back on, speaker swap and sound deadening is easy. The headliner is a big pain, though.

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